3SOF

Is it difficult to make a good income as a trader?  Are the odds favored strongly in the educated traders side?  With discipline and proper money management what percentage of people that attempt trading for a living should be successful? 

Any suggestions or insight into the full time job of trading stocks would be greatly appreciated. 


My dilemma is as follows.. I have a very profitable small business which only takes 5 to 10 hours of my time a week to run. So I have an unlimited amount of free time available to dedicate to another venture.. I entered the market with a very small stake 2 months ago out of boredom, but I have become fascinated by the price action of the stocks, the companies, the psychology of the investors and everything else the market has to offer.. I can use as large of a stake as I want in the market, but I want to make sure that I know what I'm doing before I get in deeper.. I need to learn much much more... 

You all seem like Pros and I'm sure all of you went through the same thing in your investing  career so I thought I'd ask for a little wisdom in this matter from people that have been through the stages of it.. Many of you are proof that it can be done, but is this a rare thing or are their loads of successful traders out there bringing in good incomes?

Trunk,
I sense you're a good man and anything is possible if you develop a discipline and stick to it. David doesn't just speak about arbitrary rules, he follows them personally. Only a 6.66% position, not paying attention too much to intraday moves, are a few. Much can be gained here and you don't even have to use your own money to learn. Just watch for a little while, study past closed positions, then when you think you are ready start by taking smaller steps, maybe 3.33% of your portfolio.
I often have to honestly ask myself "am I just gambling?" and the truth is that when I have gambled in the past I would make a uneducated/uninformed even wager, usually spread across a defined set of possibilities. Then I would sit back and think "the odds would eventually turn in my favor."
Here, I've learned to make decisions quite differently. I'm not perfect at it, but now I usually buy because of well established and respected technical patterns, momentum swings, or fundalemental value. Much of this information is available at other sites, but I believe with the dialogue of this community, a person can make a good living.
I hope you don't hold me responsible for your fortunes, good or bad, but I will always share my thoughts with you.

Thanks TommyT.. That was very helpful and applauded.. I guess I'll need another year or so before I convince myself that I can succeed at it and bring a much larger stake to the market.

lol.. and don't worry I won't hold you or anyone else responsible for my failures (although I don't plan on having any).. Its just great to have a website like this and such helpful, educated and humble people to exchange ideas with.. May we all prosper

Hey Trunk, I think you are very lucky you found this place at the start of your trading education.  All the statistics point to most traders failing at what they do.  I think the number is around 90%(but how they get this number...?)  Are you up to the challenge?

I think the key here as with most things is to study, practice, set-up rules, do-it on a small scale, re-update rules, do-it.  Most importantly, I think, is you can not be anyone other than yourself.  So know that when you trade you are not Jesse Livermore or David Randolph  .  You are TRUNK, lol, and so things must make sense to you.

I think its awesome that you have a small business. Good for you!  I think you will find that you will be able to trade a lot better without feeling that trading is your only source of income.  That is a lot of pressure.

It is very easy, nowadays, to get way way way tooooooo much information.  Yes ignorance is bliss sometimes    But in the beginning you are in the knowledge gathering phase.  You're gonna come across absolute crap  theres no avoiding it.  You just gotta be a good filter.

If you are comfortable with losing about 2k I believe you can speed up the learning process by starting a small trading account.  Thats how I started(i was not comfortable with losing half in 3 months  )  Of course I'm saying all this stuff without knowing what level you are at but this way you can see level II bid and ask, market makers, commision fees, trading platforms and feel the emotions of the market.

I could go on forever so if you have any specific questions I'll try to assist. 

Excelent question Agent Trunk ,,from the land of US, city of ummm Trunk. Remember you are Trunk from the land of Trunk, Trunk island 12345. Your mission is to seek and find information pertaining to the purchase and demise of stocks. Should you suceede we suceede , should you fail the world as we know it will go on   lol. Remember you are an island , if we can help we will, ( not i but the rest, ive seen the other agents in action) .
   I have read some really good books , and i know the rest of the gang here can reccomend some excellent ones, and try to help you aviod the garbage ones. Its awsome you get to work at a small but profitable business.   Tony G

it aint easy, it ain't easy, it ain't easy. I cant say it enough. So many people assume that because the market is open to them that they can make money trading stocks, arrogance personified.
you will have to be smarter and more disiciplined than over 90% of the people that are already trading. So only if you think you are capable of achieving that should you consider it. That is something that cannot be accomplished overnight. So until then , the safest way to approach it is to find a pro and follow him , and I don't mean a chat room or news letter ego driven power monger. I mean a real trader , who isn't in there to play or show off his leadership skills  but is there for one reason only, to make money.

jmho

hi,
i am so glad to have found this site. i am also new to trading with a 3000 account . i study david bowdens method of swing trading called safety in the market. but infomation is your friend and the best thing you can do is find a system that works for you and stick to your plan . run everything through your plan filter . these guys at this site are great and very helpful . but there is no substitute for knowledge and sticking to your plan .  good luck ! i hope everyone wins!

Trunk, here's a thread I started a while back, asking about some good books to get me started. Got some great suggestions and tips from the "heavy hitters" 


http://www.3stocksonfire.org/trading/index.php?topic=1267.0


Elite also recommended I look at the free chart school at www.stockcharts.com. It's helped A LOT...


Good luck, dude!

D'Wheeze

Hi Trunk
You've asked an awesome question with no real answer.I'm also new at this.Have been trying to learn it for one and a half years now.Told my wife I have found something that moves up and down in price faster than cigerettes and gas.One of my biggest problems I've got to learn so far is I sell to fast on a winner and hold loosers to long so win I make a winning trade I turn around and loose it to another one.Drives me cracy.
I want to give you a site to visit that might help in you're learning process.,,financevisor.com,,.It's a great learning site.
  I want to also applaud 3stocksonfire I have searched many sites to try to help me with my goals of trying to win at this game and this has got to be the best on the web #1 in my book.
Good luck and learn patience (learn not to jump in to fast and not to jump out to fast)

Quote from: TRUNK on July 09, 2005, 08:30:08 PM
Is it difficult to make a good income as a trader?  Are the odds favored strongly in the educated traders side?  With discipline and proper money management what percentage of people that attempt trading for a living should be successful? 

Any suggestions or insight into the full time job of trading stocks would be greatly appreciated. 


My dilemma is as follows.. I have a very profitable small business which only takes 5 to 10 hours of my time a week to run. So I have an unlimited amount of free time available to dedicate to another venture.. I entered the market with a very small stake 2 months ago out of boredom, but I have become fascinated by the price action of the stocks, the companies, the psychology of the investors and everything else the market has to offer.. I can use as large of a stake as I want in the market, but I want to make sure that I know what I'm doing before I get in deeper.. I need to learn much much more... 

You all seem like Pros and I'm sure all of you went through the same thing in your investing  career so I thought I'd ask for a little wisdom in this matter from people that have been through the stages of it.. Many of you are proof that it can be done, but is this a rare thing or are their loads of successful traders out there bringing in good incomes?

I am not smart, experience 3yrs + results 30%-

Trunk   i wanna know what your profitable small business is so i can hang with you on the computer all day            Tony g